Crimson Flag Comic Forums
Other Realms => Art Gallery => Topic started by: Jonas on October 19, 2009, 08:53:46 PM
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Umm, hi. I've recently gotten the urge to try my paw at drawing, and I've grown rather fond of Vimir's style. Since the sources we learn from influence our style's, I figured asking where he learned might help me mimic it in my own way... does anyone know or is this getting creepy-stalkerish? {fox}
Edit: Changed "writing" to "drawing". This is what happens when I make posts late at night >>
And I changed the thread title... -- Tvorsk
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In my opinion, two words: Metamor Keep. At least, that's MY opinion on Virmir. But, in reality, a writing style comes not only from what you read, but what you experience in life as well.
Since you're here, go to the chat room at the nearest opportunity, as a good portion of us are writers here, and the chat room is the best place to talk with us. If you really want to write EXACTLY like Virmir, I can so help you analyze one of his stories that you liked, or any other one. Everyone here calls me "AnalystWolf"...thanks to Virmir's drawing of me...
Ummmmm...welcome! Hope you enjoy your time here!
((Virmir, feel free to comment on where you gained your inspiration.))
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Oh bollocks! I just read my own post. I meant DRAWING! I already write XD
This is what I get for doing posts so late at night >.>
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Moving back to Art Section then |:P
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Thank you. Technically I don't actually need to know how he started, but if I could find a step-by step guide to drawing something like his "Cute and Fluffy" picture, then I can adapt it to my own characters. One of the weird things I can do well is alter, but not design. Not sure how that works really.
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Oh you're in luck! Virmir just started to record his ustreams at: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/virmir You can watch him do his drawings step by step! I guess you're trying to adapt his drawing techniques to your own style?
Do you have an DA or FA account? it would be cool too see that you have done so far!
(haha Its not that creepy/Staklerish, I'm curious too at how other artists approach things! ]:))
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Ah, thanks. this should help. And I haven't actually drawn anything before other than a few tracings =/
I've written alot though. I have a shifti page under the name LloydBrunnel.http://shifti.org/wiki/User:Lloyd_Brunnel (http://shifti.org/wiki/User:Lloyd_Brunnel)
Edit: Just checked the link you provided. Handy, but I guess I was hoping for something more along the lines of this => http://www.howtoodraw.com/fox-how-to-draw-a-quick-drawing/ and the stream is too long to use properly, which is expected I guess.
Oh well, beggars can't be choosers after all. Thanks again for the link. I'll see what I can learn from it.
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Hi Lloyd!
I'm flattered you like my drawings. Thank you very much!
The truth is, I'm pretty much entirely self taught apart from the occasional tutorial or so. It's been, heck, about a three-year-long experience of trial and error for me. Only recently have I started considering myself somewhat decent. [;)
I doodled before a bit before then, but I would say my real starting point was around the end of 2006 when I bought a drawing tablet and decided I wanted to draw foxes. [;) The only decent tutorial I could find was this (http://kitfox247.deviantart.com/art/Request-How-to-Muzzle-views-38751746) on how to do muzzles. Apart from that, I just (frustratingly) tried to scribble out what I wanted and hoped it worked out. Some artists recommend looking at another piece of work for reference. Truth be told, even though I often intend to find good reference pictures, I rarely do this and usually end up trying to figure things out on my own.
After I hired Tod to do the pencils for Crimson Flag, I'll admit I leeched some traits off of him from tracing his foxes over and over again. [;) Most notably would be the four fingered hands and ruffles in the ears.
You'll probably get this anywhere, but I'll say it again because it really is true. The only way to learn how to draw is to practice. Aside from the comic, I'm trying to draw one or two drawings per week. I've been doing this for nearly a year and I've improved tremendously just by drawing over and over again. In June I did a Sketch Month, in which I drew a sketch every single day for 30 days straight with no exceptions. Again, marked improvement from start to finish. I'm going to do another one sometime soon. [;)
It's going to be very frustrating at first. It was for me. But keep at it. If you *really* want it, you'll get it. [;)
Good luck! And post your ventures for us to see. [:)
Also, yay, Shifti page. Will check a few of those stories out some time. [;)
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Thank you very much for the advice. It also turns out that the stream became alot more useful when I figured out how to skip ahead/rewind >>
The result is this:
(http://C:\Users\Documents\082015.jpg)
Something tells me I need to rethink my approach ><
I'll start some fiddling on my own now, but does anyone know where I can find a tutorial for drawing sitting animals?
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Thank you very much for the advice. It also turns out that the stream became alot more useful when I figured out how to skip ahead/rewind >>
We are planning to post a cleaned-up sped-up versions of the stream recordings somewhere in the mid-far future... hopefully Relatively Soon Now.
The result is this:
[ img ]http://C:\Users\<your login name removed for privacy>\Documents\082015.jpg[ /img ]
Umm... I'm afraid that you need to post the pic to ImageShack, Photobucket, Flickr or similar and give us a link to THAT... links to your home computer's hard drive don't really work. {fox}
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Umm... I'm afraid that you need to post the pic to ImageShack, Photobucket, Flickr or similar and give us a link to THAT... links to your home computer's hard drive don't really work. {fox}
Oh also http://www.artspots.com/ Might be good as well, its an art gallery for anthropomorphic arts, you might like it! It's what Virmir uses to upload pics here as well!
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Uhh, will this work?
http://lloydbrunnel.artspots.com/image/37966/first-drawing (http://lloydbrunnel.artspots.com/image/37966/first-drawing)
Anyway... I'm thinking my current approach needs some work. I'll probably fiddle around trying to produce something without glancing over at a guide every 3sec, though if someone could point me in the direction of a tutorial for drawing a sitting animal I'd much appreciate it.
Oh, and what program was Vimir using in the stream? I've never seen something like that before.
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Awesome, Lloyd. [:)
I use Paint Tool SAI (http://sai.detstwo.com/sai/), which is kind of like a simplified Photoshop with vector tools.
Don't know any tutorials for sitting animals, but I might try doodling one sometime. [;)
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Downloaded, but having trouble starting since all my circles end up really blocky >> do you use a stylus or something?
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Yea, he uses a tablet-pc! they are awesome things! But somewhat expensive especislly of you already have a laptop!
SAI was basically designed to be used with a tablet-pc (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tablet_PC) or a graphics tablet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphics_tablet) since it accepts the tablets pressure sensitivity and other features.
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blorg! Well, there goes that idea. Better stick to pencils then =(
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Don't worry, pencils are fun, too. Remember, I started using a tablet, but then discovered that I loved working with pencil so much more that all my tablet is doing is gathering dust. But, whatever method you decide to use, make sure you post it here! ]:) We'll be waiting!
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Ok! Here's my finished product...
(http://lloydbrunnel.artspots.com/image_sizes/0025/9006/Jonas_Trace.jpg)
I think it turned out well for a first attempt. Few questions though based on how I saw Vimir use it in the stream:
1. Which tool produces the pencil/ink-like effect? I couldn't figure out how to reproduce it.
2. While colouring, how did he manage to keep it between the lines >>
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In SAI, Virmir used the Pencil 'brush' for the initial sketch, but for the Inking stage, he added a 'Line work Layer' and used the 'Pen tool'
I'm sure Vir will give a more detailed answer later, but he basically uses the tablet PC's pen to basically draw on the screen like it was a piece of paper, and he places the Ink layers on top of the colouring layers.
(I'm just saying stuff as he got me to use SAI + the fact I keep bugging him on how he uses it)
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Nice, Lloyd!
Yep, that's correct. Each color is on it's own layer underneath the linework layer. And the nice thick lines are a result of the pen tool on a linework layer in SAI. These are vector lines, meaning I can resize them without any loss in quality and even move them around, change thickness, etc. Really useful stuff if you're ever interested in getting into SAI.
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Oh. I've been using the pen tool but it doesn't seem any different apart from the type of the line it creates. How do you make a vector line?
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You don't see much of a difference when drawing the lines, but afterward you can go into edit mode and drag the points of the line around to change the curvature, or edit the pressure of the line to adjust thickness. Also if you resize the drawing, the vector lines won't degrade in quality.
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So they're used to alter proportion?
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That's one possibility. The general rule is if you want crisp, solid lines, vectors are better.
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Grrrrr, you vector people and your crisp, clean lines. It can show naught of the human condition!
(Just saying that Vector gives you that Virmir-like, smooth, computery look, but using raster((non-vector)) tools can give you a nice sort of look, too.)
Ummmmmm, using a mouse for raster computer drawings is REALLY hard. If you're doing that, vector might be the way to go.
....I look forward to your next drawing!
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Ooo, thanks for asking this stuff Lloyd, it saves me from inquiring the same things. ]:P I'm usually a casual "ink by paint tool" fellow (and ink by Photoshop's Ink Pen with the mouse) but I shall have to look into this strange land of vector. Either with SAI...or the fancy Illustrator CS4 the college compys happen to have. Been wondering how Virmir got thos fancy (and crispy) lines.
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Uhh, how do I go into "edit mode" anyway?
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Grrrrr, you vector people and your crisp, clean lines. It can show naught of the human condition!
(Just saying that Vector gives you that Virmir-like, smooth, computery look, but using raster((non-vector)) tools can give you a nice sort of look, too.)
Well really, you dont need vector to get Virmir's "look", he just used) a Round, Pressure sensitive, brush with no Opacity change (ie: when pressing harder with the pen, it only changes the diameter of the brush, not how dark it is). Its a basic Brush in many Digital Art programs, Photoshop, Corel Painter, OpenCanvas, etc etc, you could easily take any of these and get the same type of brush if you fiddled with it.
The vector stuff, really just makes it easy to resize the lines, + it has a 'Smoothing' effect on the lines too (its a setting that can be set, in SAI) Vir told me before he uses... 0 or 8 for sketches and I think 15 for Inking.
I think the real 'secret' to his style' is more of the fact he uses the tablet PC to draw his stuff, where in making a line he would naturally go from soft-hard-soft in pressure to get the Inked line look. You could emulate it through Photoshop or SAI but the whole process is 100x harder, where you would need to manually tweak each line to emulate the thickness differences.
Uhh, how do I go into "edit mode" anyway?
In SAI, and you've made a 'Linework Layer', right underneath the 'Pen' tool is the 'edit tool'. But To fiddle with a Vector lines thickness, use the 'Pressure tool' (which is the to the right of the edit tool) then the lines will start showing those green dots again, where you can drag them to make the vector line in that area, thicker or thinner.
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Ok! Final question! I've made another picture on SAI but it's smaller than I'd like. Is there any way to scale it to a larger size without redrawing it?
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In the top menu, go to Canvas -> Change Resolution, then enter how big you want it to be. Your vector layers will scale up with out a loss in quality, but your normal layers may get a bit blurry, depending on how big you go.
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Thanks a bunch! I'm done my picture now and am using it as my icon ^^
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Heheh! for the Icon/avatar, how about a backgound of some sort?
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I tried =/
I have a copy of the icon with a green background but for some reason that one won't upload to my profile.